\\File name Brett's Site
Electromagnetic radiation and its effect on the brain: an insider speaks out
Another Interview Transcript Below
Jenny Crwys Williams interviews Barrie Trower, retired British military
intelligence scientist in microwave and stealth warfare
Mon, 19 Apr 2010 11:31 EDT
Jenny Crwys-Williams: Now we're speaking to Barrie Trower, and it is Trower isn't it?
Barrie Trower: Yes ma'am.
JCW: And Barrie you are a retired British military intelligence scientist, and for years and years and years you worked in microwave and stealth warfare. What does that actually mean?
BT: During the 1950s...and may I say good afternoon ma'am...
JCW: ~Laughs~ Good afternoon.
BT: During the 1950s and 1960s during the Cold War, it was realised both
by accident that microwaves could be used as stealth weapons against the
Russians beamed the American embassy during the Cold War and it gave
everybody working in the embassy cancer, breast cancers, leukemias
whatever, and it was realised then that low level microwaves were the
perfect stealth weapon to be used on dissident groups around the world,
because you could make dissident groups sick, give them cancer, change
their mental outlook on life without them even knowing they were being
radiated, and one of my particular tasks...I spent eleven years questioning
captured spies...one of my particular tasks was to learn the particular
frequencies of microwaves that they used on which particular victims, if I
may use that word, and what the outcome was, and I built up a dossier...I'm
probably the only person in the world with the complete list...I built up a
dossier of what pulse frequencies of microwaves will cause what psychological
or physiological damage to a person.
JCW: That's not covered under the official secrets act or anything like that, is it?
BT: To be honest ma'am, I don't care about the official secrets act when I
see what is going on in the world through...really ignorance... what I call
ignorance. I think the official secrets act goes by the [ball?].
They can do with me what they like, but I feel that it is my task to
answer questions from governments, royalty, schools, anybody around the
world, I tell them exactly what I know, exactly what I've done so that
governments and organisations and people can actually make safe levels.
JCW: Okay, so you did this work for eleven years, but you've also been
involved, obviously, in stealth warfare microwave, and your particular
expertise was on the impact of this radiation on health and brain
JCW: And you debriefed microwaved spies and dissidents and things as you
explained to us. So what are you doing here in South Africa?
BT: I was asked to come...
JCW: ...stranded in South Africa...
BT: ...stranded in South Africa, well, not stranded until tomorrow, uhm,
there's a very young lady who was sitting outside...organised a series of
lectures and talks for...there's a little boy not far away with a
tumour...near a transmitter and I was asked to go see the little boy and
discuss what I knew...uhm.. .his majesty in Botswana asked me to give a
conference, or present a conference to his ministers on, not only the
health issues, but the environmental impact to the animals.
Uhm...I'm doing a public talk this evening for anybody to turn up...so,
it's really the young lady taking me around. I have a series of interviews,
lectures, newspaper articles...anyone that really wants to know will just
come and ask whatever questions they like to ask. So I'm here as a guest in
what I think is the most beautiful country in the world without a shadow of
a doubt, and I'm being taken around and asked questions which I'm
JCW: Alright, so just remember the lines are open, 883 0702 and if someone
is erecting say a...we're talking cell phone masts, aren't we?
BT: Cell phone...ordinary cell phone masts...and wi fi.
JCW: Okay, and wi fi in your office...and. ..
BT: Yup, and walkabout telephones.. .anything which emits microwaves.
JCW: Okay, so if you've got any questions, give us a call on 883 0702 and
we've got an expert here and he has got information that very few people, I
dare say, are privy to. So what is electromagnetic radiation? Just
explain...it's the same thing as microwaves? Is that correct?
BT: The electromagnetic spectrum is a band that goes from gamma rays and
x-rays at one end, the very high energy waves, and it comes down through
visible light, which is also some radiation, and then it goes through
infrared microwaves, tv and radio. Now the only ones which really affect us
in the communications industry are the microwaves, and microwaves have a
special ability to interfere with water, which is how microwave ovens work,
and we are made of water.
All of our chemical and electrical signals involve water in the body,
somehow, electrical communications in the body. So, the industry has picked
the worst possible part of the electromagnetic spectrum to give to young
children and to adults.
JCW: And here we are talking about cell phones for instance...that's what
you're talking about.
BT: Cell phones yes, yes ma'am.
JCW: So, if France for instance is saying that children should not be
given mobile phones under the age of fourteen, for instance...uhm. ..the
European parliament voted by a large majority to recommend tighter safety
standards, and this included wi fi and whatever, but also protecting
vulnerable groups like children...pregnant moms as well?
BT: Absolutely ma'am...uhm...can I come back to your first point?
BT: Uhm...I saw quite a large delegation from France a few years ago, and
not just down to me, but they obviously took heed of what I said and went
off and checked a few things, but, we know now in France, I'll have it
published, that they are pulling wi fi out of every single French school,
on health grounds.
JCW: Now, presumably, they wouldn't have done that had they not known, or
maybe seen the results of wi fi, because wi fi has probably been in schools
in France for...what.. .ten years, or is that an exaggeration?
BT: I don't know what the answer is. I don't know how long wi fi has been
in French schools. I do know that they are spending now 174 million Euros
rewiring wi fi sets with fiber optic cables or ordinary cables...uhm.
..because of the risk to the health...mainly to young women...that the
health risk, and if you care to ask, I'll happily answer.
The main risk from wi fi is to young girls, and the main risk which we
know...uhm.. .to children is to the fetus or the infant. But, children are
much more vulnerable than adults...with this radiation, the smaller you
are, the more you absorb. So, the main risk is to young girls and the
fetus, or the infant.
JCW: And, to young girls, are you talking about sterility for instance?
BT: No ma'am, it's worse than that I'm afraid. I don't want to scare your
listeners, but I believe in the truth. Uhm, I have one other...uhm.
..research papers here. I have three research papers. I am a scientific
adviser to five organisations, which, part of my brief is I read
international scientific papers, I retranslate them into a language that
most people can understand, which is how I advise.
Now to answer your question, ma'am...uhm...I have three papers showing
that low level microwaves can interfere with the genetics in the ovarian
follicles. Now what that means in everyday language, different from boys,
young girls when they're born, they will have up to four hundred eggs in
their ovaries. The microwaves can damage the genetic structure, we now
know, in those ovaries. So, when this young girl grows up, gets married,
and has children, if she has a daughter, this particular mitochondrial
genetic damage is irreparable. There is nothing at all that can repair it.
So, if she has a daughter, the daughter will carry that genetic deformity,
and her daughter will carry it, and her daughter will carry it. So, it
isn't a game anymore, it isn't a little box that you can press buttons and
run around in, and have fun with, we are now seriously jeopardising the
future generations for as long as there is a female line of our children's
children's children, and that is to me the most scariest aspects of all of
JCW: All right, now if you've just tuned in, we're chatting to Barrie
Trower who is a retired British military intelligence scientist. For years
and years he's worked in microwave and stealth warfare, and his particular
expertise was on the impact of this radiation on health and brain
functioning, and he is here. We are chatting about microwaves, we are
talking about wi fi, we're talking about cell phone masts, we're talking
about the damage done to vulnerable groups of people...everyone of course
is vulnerable, but there's some groups that are more vulnerable than the
others, and kids texting, and you know that they can spend hours and hours
and hours texting...bad, bad, bad news. But give us a call on 883 0702 if
you've got any questions, and we'll take them right after this.
All right, well let's go to Lance, so Lance thank you, you've been holding
on for quite some time, and you're chatting to Barrie Trower, and you've
got a question.
Lance: Yeah I do, thanks Jen. Barrie, I've got a question. We work in an
office building, we're on the first floor, above us is a concrete ceiling
and there's another floor and there's a concrete roof and then there's a
cellular base station on top of that, and I must be honest, I'm not
entirely happy about that and I'd like to my question is really sort of
what are the implications of that? Is it actually quite dangerous number
one and number two, is there something we can actually do to our ceiling,
like literally foil it and then earth the foil, you know something like
that to actually reduce these radiation?
BT: Uh, good afternoon sir. Uhm...the first part of your question with a
transmitter on the roof, there is research from India, uhm...from a
professor in India from the university, that shows that people living
beneath a transmitter tend to suffer more neurological damage than people
who do not have transmitters on their roof. In other words, you will have
psychiatric problems, you will also have a reduced immune system. In other
words, it could mean that you have more colds, more coughs, longer colds,
longer coughs, and your general health could deteriorate. Uhm, that has
been tested experimentally and published.
The second part of your question sir, is there something you can do
to...like bursting a boil I believe you said, was that correct sir?
Lance: Uhm, no-no-no-no- no, uhm, getting...putting foil, tin foil, in our
BT: Oh tin foil! I thought you said bursting a boil!
Lance: Oh! No-no! Literally like putting tin strips, you know, roles that
they put in the roof and earthing it. Something like that.
BT: Yes sir, okay...uhm, this can be done sir, but not tin foil. Tin foil
actually has little microscopic holes and lets the radiation through and in
fact focuses it. Uhm, what you could use is aluminum tin, which they use in
the building industry, radiator foil, aluminum foil, the thick insulating
aluminum foil, that, between you and the roof, shiny side to the roof, that
will reduce the radiation coming in.
JCW: But Lance, on your behalf, if it reduces the radiation coming in,
Barrie, it doesn't eliminate it, does it? So presumably then you are still
BT: Without a doubt, yes, but less of a risk.
Lance: Uhm...Jen? Sorry, can I...I missed the beginning of the show. I
just want to ask Barrie...uhm. ..what like...uhm, how come you're actually
here...in the country?
JCW: Well listen, I don't want to repeat everything, but he's now retired,
he's a retired British military intelligence scientist, and for decades
he's worked in microwave and stealth warfare, and this is his area of
expertise, and he's been invited to South Africa to speak.
Lance: Oh, okay cool, so not for soccer...
JCW: No not for soccer, ~laughs~ bit early for that, and Josef, wi fi
Josef: Ja, thank you Jenny and Barrie, uhm...
BT: Good afternoon, sir.
Josef: I'm...good afternoon. I'm aware that a lot of research has been
done on this and there are many reports concerning the harmful effects of
this kind of radiation, my concern number one, before I get to the
precaution side is that if governments are resisting the actual truth on
these reports because it would affect revenue, but secondly I'm also aware
that there are precautions that certain companies have taken in
manufacturing [?], certain [?] that can be attached to one's cell phone, to
one's laptop, to one's microwave... can be inserted in plug points in order
to minimise the harmful effects of the radiation and in fact change the
frequencies so that the body actually sees them as healthy frequencies as
opposed to harmful frequencies. Can you elaborate on that?
BT: Uhm, could I answer the first...I was concentrating on the second.
What was the first question? Sorry.
Josef: The first question was that governments seem to be deliberately
resisting the actual reports.
BT: Yes, can I answer that part first, and then we'll come to the second
part. Uhm, when I address governments, what they don't realise is that
there is an initial boost to the government from the industry, putting up
towers, and paying rent and anything else that is being paid, but I was
talking to a government just two weeks ago, and I said can you really
afford this system unregulated, and I'll tell you why, sir, because most of
the money generated from the cell phones, apart from the tax, leaves the
country. It's estimated that from the illnesses, the health bill could go
up as much as forty percent in some countries, and they're not prepared for
that. May I just finish, sir.
The third aspect of this, and this has been calculated by The Times, an
editor in The Times, that the cost to the planet in making the pollinating
insects sick, that pollinate the plants that feed the planet, the cost
could be as much as thirty three trillion, that's a million million, US
dollars a year. So, when it comes to profit, there may be a lovely initial
boost for the government, but when I address governments, I say, have your
economists actually sat down and worked out the real cost of all of this,
and they haven't.
That's the first part of your question, sir, the second part was...
JCW: Well I think you've answered that in full. Let's move on. Ryan,
you've touched on the answer that Barrie has just given about pollinating
insects, and your question is about bee colony collapse disorder? Hi there
Ryan... All right, Ryan from Gallow Manor asked the question about bees
which are in trouble, and that of course is pollination, that's what we're
BT: I could expand on that, just one thing.
BT: Uhm, I've done a lot of research on bees, and in fact I gave a lecture
just before I came to this country. The bees are out of all of the insects,
all of the animals that are affected, bees are affected worst. And the
reason is, is that they are the size that the frequency of the microwaves
can react with most. They have three different types of iron in their
bodies that help them navigate, they use the earth's magnetic field to
navigate, but the microwaves going through the bees, will remagnetise what
they use for the earth's magnetic field, so they are disorientated.
And the other part, and this has been published in Nature, the planet's
foremost scientific journal. They have found that the bees' visual
navigation system where they use the sun, that is also affected by all
microwave frequencies, so the bottom line is, bees will get lost, their
immune systems will suffer and then eventually whatever illness they come
across, the varroa mite, anything, that will then take its course. But the
bottom line here is that migratory insects, even ants, will be
JCW: All right, so give us a call, 883 0702. I've got a whole lot of
questions I want to ask, Barrie, and yes they do revolve around cell
phones, children, masts in playgrounds and masts in buildings and things
like that. Should we be concerned, or should we just lie back and take it
as it's given to us?
Now Barrie, before we get onto cell phone masts and things like that, what
does the World Health Organisation say about what you are saying?
BT: The World Health...it's a very good question. The World Health
Organisation were challenged by the European parliament very recently, on
their stance. The World Health Organisation replied in writing to the
European parliament, and I have that document here.
The first thing they said was that they will not give any form of comments
or estimate of the impact of this, health wise, until 2015, and they also
said that they only started to study the effect on children, last year. So
that may be in fifteen years, fourteen years time. So the World Health
Organisation are not actually saying anything.
JCW: So, how could they have been so lax as not to start, because the
rumours have been going around for years and years and years and years. One
would have liked to have thought that they would have picked up earlier on.BT: There are to my knowledge legal issues here where parliaments are
questioning the decision making processes of the World Health Organisation,
and this is an opinion that there may be industrial influences with the
committee that helps run the World Health Organisation, and I do know there
are legal questions headed that way, but, everybody including myself is
bemused, because a few years ago, we looked at the World Health
Organisation's database on electromagnetic radiation of the microwave
communication frequencies, and eighty percent of all of their data showed
either cancer increases, neurological disorders, what they call microwave
syndrome, which is electro sensitivity. Eighty percent of their research
showed this, but they were doing nothing about it.
JCW: What is the Bio-Initiative Report?
BT: The Bio-Initiative Report, it really flew in the face of the World
Health Organisation's lack of support. Two thousand...no I tell a
lie...several scientists from around the world, leading scientists from
around the world, spent many years studying the latest two thousand
research papers. They cross checked them, they read them, they looked at
them, they argued, the discussed, and the scientists who wrote the
Bio-Initiative Report, they decided on a safe level that would include
children, and they listed all of the illnesses and they came out with this
safe level that they considered with today's knowledge, today's experts, a
safe level for children and everybody else for a lifetime's exposure.
They published this safe level, and anybody can read it and anybody can
use it. To my knowledge it's been picked up by six or eight governments so
far, two were already on it, and I think another six have decided to ignore
the international guidelines, ignore the World Health Organisation, and to
go straight to the Bio-Initiative safety level.
JCW: How long is it before you start showing, for instance if there's a
mast in a child's playground, and you've got children going there every
single day apart from school holidays, how long does it take before some of
them might start showing symptoms, and theirs can be things such as nausea
for instance, or dizziness or rashes and things like that, there's the
initial stages are they not?
BT: Absolutely correct. The three percent, we know from experiments from
around the world, the minimum that will show signs instantly, almost
instantly, within minutes, is three percent, so, if you have a hundred
children in your school, three of them will show signs straight away.
The Nobel Prize winning Irish Doctors Association believe it's probably
nearer fifteen percent, but I'm settling for three at the moment. So we
know three percent initially, and then, depending on the child's state of
health and a few other factors, probably within eighteen months to a few
years, you will then have the more serious symptoms starting to show.
JCW: What about houses that are in the proximity of that particular mast
BT: Absolutely the same, ma'am, absolutely the same. Children are
everywhere. The problem we find with schools...and may I just say
that...may I just come in with a piece of research please?
In 2003, there was an international study of schools in just France and
Spain, and they found a hundred and thirty leukemia clusters in schools
that had transmitters in the playground. Just a few years later I was
invited to address the Welch parliament, and I found another forty seven,
so, by the end of 2006, between England, France and Spain, we had over two
hundred leukemia clusters in schools of eleven children or more, aged
eleven or under. That is over two thousand children.
JCW: Right, well that's...I mean that is an alarming statistic. What about
adults? What about teachers? What about people living in the houses nearby
that are not children?
BT: The report I wrote, and I'm having it published soon, but I've left
copies behind, I've referenced the report that looked at all the schools
and they did find that there was elevated breast cancer...uhm. ..the first
symptom in a lady tends to be breast cancer if it's going to be serious.
There was elevated breast cancer in the teachers, psychological problems,
general ill health...so. ..my...when I've travelled, and I have been right
around the world, and I say to any school and any of your listeners now can
check this, anyone, I say if you have a transmitter in your school, I will
guarantee, absolutely guarantee two things; first, the sickness level will
go up, and that includes staff, and the behaviour of the children and the
exam results will go down.
JCW: All right, well that's a huge claim. What area are we talking about?
What circumference are we talking about?
BT: No mobile transmitter should be within a kilometer and a half of a
school, if it is an ordinary transmitter, putting out an ordinary 20 Watt
microwave beam. It should certainly not be within a kilometer and a half of
JCW: If it's in the middle of a high street and it's on top of a two
BT: No, it shouldn't be there. There is no reason for microwave
transmitters to be near people. They can be moved far away from people. The
only reason they're near people is because it saves the company money.
They're easier to maintain. If you have to maintain a transmitter, it's
easier to pull up with a lorry and a ladder, and go straight up, than into
the middle of a field, with a four wheel drive truck, and reach one there.
It's purely to do with profit.
JCW: Let's go to Eric. Hi there Eric, you've got a question about
Eric: Ja, hi Jenny, hi Barrie.
BT: Good afternoon, sir.
Eric: Barrie said that microwave frequency is 2.4 GHz, and I guess that's
where most of the damage occurs, and I'm just wondering how far you have to
move away from that frequency on either side before you can minimise
damage, or is there no effect?
BT: All of the...the microwave frequencies go from 300 Mhz to 300 GHz, and
it's not so much the frequency, sir, it's the pulse frequency or the
modulation frequency that they put with it. That tends to do most of the
damage. So, it's not a question of the microwave frequency per se, it's a
question of all of the pulse and modulation frequencies that carry the
pictures, the movement, the sound.
Those are the ones which are known to cause the damage, and I'm not
blaming the industry here, they invent something, and there is nobody
around that will say to them, hang on, you are picking a particularly
dangerous pulse frequency or modulation frequency, change it. All the
industry has to do, is turn to a government or turn to somebody like me,
and say, would you comment. The problem is solvable, but, to answer your
question, sir, it's really the modulation or the pulse frequency, the
carrier waves that they put in, that tend to do most of the damage.
JCW: All right, Eric, interesting questions, thank you. And here's another
one, Themba asking this question: what are the effects of microwaves when
using blue tooth in the car, which many of us do, and/or when the blue
tooth device is actually on your person?
BT: Two questions, the first you should never ever use a microwave
transmitter inside a car, because they reflect all of the microwaves
backwards and forwards and backwards and forwards, and you are effectively
putting yourself into a microwave oven. That is the first thing. The other
thing is that we know from experiments, and this has been published, that
when you have microwaves near your brain, we know that...it was carried out
on children, and a child who used a microwave transmitter, an ordinary cell
phone, for two minutes, had his natural brain waves disrupted for two hours
Now when you disrupt your natural brain waves, it's called entrainment,
any personality change, depending which part of the brain you're changing,
any personality change can occur, and that's just with two minutes. So if
you have children in your car or you are using a blue tooth near your
brain, you are effectively entraining your brain.
Now if you are using your blue tooth for several minutes, then the chances
are your brain will be entrained for many, many, many hours, and if you use
a mobile phone and blue tooth, a mobile phone and blue tooth, on and off
through the day, then your brain will not actually function properly and
you could experience all sorts of neurological funny feelings, and I'm
afraid this was the basis of my spy training and this is what they were
JCW: And lots more questions coming from listeners and I've also got some
more questions, and if you've just tuned in, we're chatting to Barrie
Trower, retired British military intelligence scientist, and he's here to
answer your questions. He's out here as a guest of the electromagnetic
radiation research foundation of South Africa, and I'll give you details of
the talk that he is going to be giving. That's a talk, a public
presentation this evening at seven pm, but I'll give you those details a
little bit later on.
All right, we're going to run out of time, but let's see how we go. Is
there a minimum amount of texting that is safe for girls?
BT: Uhm, the question is too hard for me to answer. The question really is
like 'is there a minimum amount of cigarettes a child could smoke and stay
safe'. There are so many complicated issues here, a girl may just text
once, send the microwaves straight through her ovaries, and cause genetic
damage, or she may text for a month and have no specific issues.
JCW: So you just can't say.
BT: The question is too hard to answer.
JCW: You were saying to me a moment ago whilst we were off air that if a
child uses a cell phone once a year, it's once too many. Is that not being
too rigid, too melodramatic?
BT: My own government has said that children should only use cell phones
in a life and death emergency. Some countries, I believe Russia, actually
ban children from using cell phones, but if we stick to the life and death
emergency, if a child says to me 'I've used my cell phone once a year' I
would say 'well you have a pretty rough life to have an emergency like that
every year'. A child should not use a cell phone, only in a life and death
emergency. And there are other medical issues that I don't have time to go
through, to do with the immune system and the development of the nerves,
but uhm, a child should not use a cell phone unless it's a life and death
JCW: And it should not, emphatically, the mast should not be sighted in a
BT: Absolutely not, without a shadow of a doubt.
JCW: Let's see if we can answer this question from Moira, hi there Moira.
Moira: Hi uhm, hi Barrie and Jen.
BT: Good afternoon ma'am.
Moira: My question is, do satellite dishes emit, uhm, microwave radiation
and I'm not talking about the home TV satellites, I'm talking about the 50
meter diameter satellite dishes, and the reason I ask is that I have an
factory next door to an area that is like a satellite farm. I've been
working there for 15 years and my health has deteriorated to the point
where I can't even work anymore, with neurological problems and various
BT: The easy answer to your question, ma'am is 'yes they can'.
Moira: Is it the microwaves that are the problem? Because these are
satellites that, I believe, some of them track satellites orbiting the
earth and, uhm, two that are located about ten meters from my factory are
at least 50 meters diameter.
BT: If they're tracking satellites orbiting the earth, to be honest, it
depends what the dish is there for and what it's doing. If it's tracking a
satellite then nothing should be coming your way. If it is tracking a
satellite picking up information and forwarding it to a cell tower...
Moira: Yes, that's what it does.
BT: ...or receive from a cell tower, if it's receiving from satellites and
forwarding it to a cell tower, that is, generally, sort of in the form of a
beam and if you are in the way of that beam then you are absolutely
correct, ma'am, that could be the explanation of your illness, without a
shadow of a doubt.
Moira: And can it cause things like clinical depression and neurological
problems? I've lost feeling...
JCW: Okay Moira I can't be too explicit about that but Barrie will answer
that question, thanks.
JCW: Okay. Fantastic, Barrie, you'll stay for a few minutes after the
BT: Of course.
JCW: Fantastic, that would be absolutely lovely, otherwise we're going to
run out of time, we've got lots and lots of interesting questions coming
our way, including the use of wifi which of course affects so many South
Africans and so many people all around the world. In your house, in your
car and in your office as well, so let's talk about that, and possibly ways
to combat that. Let me slip in a question to Barrie before the news and
he'll stay for about ten minutes after the news and hopefully get through
all of your questions. Barrie, just a quick question, is it safer not to
keep your cell phone next to your bed when you go to sleep at night?
BT: Oh, absolutely! What happens, if you have your cell phone next to your
bed, it is emitting microwaves if it is on standby. The microwaves go into
the body and they influence a chemical known as melatonin. The melatonin
goes around the body at night mopping up cancer cells that we can produce
every day, so if your cell phone is on beside your bed when you are
sleeping, which is the most dangerous time of the day, when you wake up,
your immune system can be 40% less effective than when you went to bed.
JCW: Really, so if you switch off that cell phone, not put it on silent,
but if you switch it off, presumably, then it's okay because it's switched
JCW: Same as television sets in the bedroom?
JCW: Same with anything that is electronic?
JCW: Goodness. Okay, so there you go, there are some quick answers to some
questions, but we'll take some of your other questions after the news. Stay
with us, I think it is a vital conversation. I think it is an important
conversation and just some information that Barrie has given me, that in
Taiwan, 1,700 schools have actually taken out wifi. I think that's what we
were talking about, they've actually got rid of it all together, very very
interesting and we'll talk about that a little bit after the news, so
please stay with us, talking to Barrie Trower.
I mentioned just before the news that Taiwan had removed all sorts of
things from school grounds, what I was talking about because it don't think
I was clear, I was vague, has already removed 1,500 masts from school
grounds or near their schools and that was as early as 2007 and yes there
have been studies around masts in schools and it's coming up negative just
Barrie, I asked you about the Bio-Initiative Report. I asked you about the
World Health Organisation. What is the Ecolog study?
BT: The Ecolog study was a study commissioned and run by the mobile
industry itself, it was a very long study, I believe it was over ten years,
with top world scientists. And, the conclusion to the Ecolog study, which
is really the mobile industry researching its own product for health
reasons and the conclusions were that low level microwaves can cause the
cancer inducers and cancer promoters to act inside the body, in other
words, they risk cancer and also there could be DNA damage.
JCW: And that's the mobile industry itself?
JCW: Now, you don't have a website.
JCW: But if people want to access your research, how do they go about
BT: If they Google, my name is Barrie Trower, if you Google my name,
nearly everything I have published or my lectures to governments, they're
all on there, I hope they're all in simple to understandable English and
you can download them for free.
JCW: Alright, let's answer some other questions, we're going to be as
quickly as we possibly can, Leonora, you've got a question?
Leonora: Yes, please, I'd like to ask Barrie if amalgam fillings, metal
fillings, be it amalgam or gold, as well as implants, titanium implants in
teeth have any impact as far as using cell phones are concerned and cell
BT: You're absolutely correct, ma'am. Any metal inside the body will
absorb microwaves and they will re-emit microwaves usually at a slightly
different wavelength, but into the body and you can get quite a serious
heating effect inside the body.
Leonora: So experiencing pins and needles and that kind of effect,
sensation, could possibly be due to that?
BT: Oh, without a shadow of a doubt ma'am, you're correct.
Leonora: Okay, all right, thank you for your answer.
BT: My pleasure, ma'am.
JCW: Stephanie, hello.
Stephanie: Hi, hi, hi Barrie, my question is, my children go to school
outside of Johannesburg and they've had to go wireless with wifi because
cables have been stolen, so the whole school is wireless. What - and they
have been approached and the school said, 'well, prove it to us' - what
could one, where could I go to, who could I speak to, to come and measure
the radiation that is going on in that school - or would you say pull them
out of the school, my children.
BT: They say prove the wifi is dangerous...
BT: You only have to quote the industry's own research in its own product.
Uhmm, the, to me, if I had children at school, I would change schools to a
school that didn't have wifi, personally. I wouldn't run the risk with my
daughter having a genetically damaged child.
Stephanie: Yeah, okay, thank you so much.
BT: My pleasure ma'am.
JCW: Alright, and it's the Ecolog study that we're talking about here.
Just some quick answers, my husband works at cell masts every day, what are
the implications for him?
BT: Wear protective clothing, very, very good protective clothing, when
you are going up or near a transmitter.
JCW: My three year old boy plays games on my cell phone daily. Is it safe
for him to continue or should I stop him?
BT: If the cell phone is just being used like a simple calculator for
games, there is no problem. If it is transmitting somewhere then there is a
JCW: Will car radios have the same effect on you, turning a car into a
microwave, if I turn on my car radio? Is that a problem?
BT: You should never , ever have microwave radiation inside a car, not
ever. Never ever.
JCW: Even if it's an old cell phone?
BT: Especially if it's an old cell phone.
JCW: Uhm, new cell pone mast is about 300 meters away beaming into my five
year old daughters bedroom, would planting trees help?
JCW: Uhm, the recommended 1.5 km radius around a cell phone mast, and
where it is safe for you to be, is that higher when 4G technology is
BT: It will be much higher and much more complicated, can I come back
please just to the lady with the four year old daughter?
BT: Uhm, one of the things you can do, cause not everybody can move house,
one thing you can do, if you get some thin tin or thick aluminum, not
cooking foil, and if you remember going back when ladies would go behind
screens if they had to undress for doctors, that sort of thing, if you
build screens and you put the aluminum or tin, on the screen, shiny side to
the transmitter and put it between the transmitter and the child's bed,
then you are shielding the child.
JCW: Oh well, then that's absolutely, that's what she's got to do.
JCW: Because she simply can't do it in... but, you probably got to do it
on all the walls in the house.
BT: Only the walls facing the transmitter.
JCW: Okay. Alright, so don't forget you can go along and Google Barrie and
get a whole lot of the stuff that we've been speaking about, and the
questions that we've been getting about 'are animals affected', well
they've got the same cellular structure that we have, of course they are
affected in the same kind of a way. But, maybe this is the last question
we're going to take, Amanda, you are asking the 64 thousand dollar
Amanda: What is the solution?
BT: That is a brilliant question, ma'am and thank you for asking it. There
is a solution, is that the governments and the industry follow the
Bio-Initiative safety level, that is all. All they have to do is turn the
knob down to a safe level, and that is the solution.
JCW: And you can access that, by the way Mandy, it's called the
Amanda: Thank you, I will do.
JCW: Okay, so, cause I think that that might be vital for many, many
people listening. Now we could go on and on and on, but we can't so Barrie
is giving a public presentation this evening. It's at 7 pm and it's at
Fourways high school which is Kingfisher Drive in Fourways and this really
and truly is, it's a unique opportunity to hear more about what is really
known about the dangers of cell phones and other wireless technology that
we are all involved in in one way or another. The health damage it is
causing, the legal battles around the world that are being fought to
actually address this issue. And this is open to all members of the public
and it is free. So that is 7 pm at Fourways high school, Kingfisher Drive
in Fourways. We're talking to Barry Trower and he is consulting to
governments and other authorities around the world on the health risks of
microwave exposure. And you can Google him and you can get your hands on
some of his research, which
is all put up there and that will amplify some of the things that we've
been speaking about today. But, Barrie, thank you, very sobering
BT: My pleasure, ma'am, thank you very much for your courtesy.
JCW: Thank you.